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Thread: For Fuck Sakes
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05-27-2011 #121
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05-27-2011 #122
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Re: For Fuck Sakes
(please dont overlook my last comment, I know this is a fast moving thread, but I'd like to see what you have to say about that)
I don't think it is beside the point at all. What nicebrn was hinting at is cultural and moral relavitism.
In Ancient Greece (for eg), there was nothing un-masculine about 'gay' sexual acts. Society's values are ever evolving!
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05-27-2011 #123
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05-27-2011 #124
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05-27-2011 #125
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05-27-2011 #126
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05-27-2011 #127
Re: For Fuck Sakes
Absolutely--that is indeed where I was going.
And a few hundred miles away in Rome, it was the opposite. Julius Caesar might have been the manliest of men, but if he was ravished by the pirates who tried to ransom him (as legend has it), Roman society would have viewed him as effeminate.
I'm going to make a strong claim and assert that all these standards are arbitrary...especially in the modern era. You can make the claim that God ordained these standards, but then that leads back to say, the Holiness Code's injunction against crossdressing (crossdressing wasn't inherently sinful, but it was contrary to the Law because it violated the divinely-established gender roles for the Israelites). The primary reason why many of them continue to endure is through sheer societal inertia.
Last edited by nicebrn; 05-27-2011 at 02:15 AM.
"...But he didn't know I had...a New Myth of my own. A myth where Ultimate Evil turns its gaze on Humanity and Humanity gazes right back and says...'Gotcha.'"
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05-27-2011 #128
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05-27-2011 #129
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Re: For Fuck Sakes
You believe that the act of penetration is inherently masculine, but that a person is not necessarily male just because they have a penis. So what is causing this masculinity if not the penis?
You inevitably have to concede that under your position something else has to be defining masculinity.
As you said, an action involves a decision. You have to choose to commit it. So this means that the deciding factor behind whether the action is masculine or not comes from the person. Their intentions behind the action.
You can say that I am masculine if I go round fighting, fucking, and scratching my arse. But these are relative values - they are not absolute. They do not make a man. Just as makeup, nagging, and enjoying shopping doesn't make a woman...
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05-27-2011 #130
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